News & Current Events
bill_coley — 2017-10-18T00:11:06-04:00 — #1
Science fiction writer Patrick Tomlinson proposes the following scenario. I think responses to it offer insight into our views as to when life begins, as well as the abortion debate. Please answer the question directly and honestly, then tell us why you answer the way you do. [NOTE: I have edited the question by changing "they" to "he or she," and by adding a parenthetical clause to the second sentence and option #3 to the possible choices:
You're in a fertility clinic. Why (you’re there) isn't important.
The fire alarm goes off. You run for the exit. As you run down this hallway, you hear a child screaming from behind a door. You throw open the door and find a five-year-old child crying for help. (He or She is) in one corner of the room. In the other corner, you spot a frozen container labeled "1,000 Viable Human Embryos." The smoke is rising. You start to choke. You know you can grab one or the other, but not both before you succumb to smoke inhalation and die, saving no one.
1. save the child
2. save the one thousand embryos
3. save neither the child nor the embryos and escape to save your own life
4. stay in the room to die with the child and the embryos
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T00:50:22-04:00 — #2
The question has nothing to do with either 1) when life begins or 2) abortion.
The scenario is imaginary, quite improbable, therefore unhelpful.
I would consider all 1002 individuals to be lives with equal value.
I would make every effort to save both the container of embyos and the child - I would not choose between them based on value.
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-10-18T03:18:59-04:00 — #3
"frozen container labeled '1000 viable human embryos' " ???
stupidity reigns supreme ...
dave_l — 2017-10-18T05:11:24-04:00 — #4
If saving my life and either one child or 100 embryos (children) remained the only possibility, I would flip a coin. Trusting God determines my call and the way the coin would land. “The lot is cast into the lap, but the whole outcome is of the LORD.” (Proverbs 16:33) And I would live henceforth with a clear conscience.
The same would apply if I could only save myself and daughter or son, or myself and wife or daughter and son.
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T06:30:02-04:00 — #5
And....not just "embryos," but human lives...imagined and created by God to live.
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-10-18T06:34:11-04:00 — #6
But most certainly NOT imagined and created by God "to be incubated" in a frozen container ...
Someone stupid idiots are playing God here and viciously violating what God has established to be accomplished in a particular way and manner ....
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T06:35:24-04:00 — #7
dave_l — 2017-10-18T06:36:30-04:00 — #8
So you would not try to save 1000 babies? Even if their origins are questionable?
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T06:39:11-04:00 — #9
Where on earth did you get an idea like that?
dave_l — 2017-10-18T06:41:29-04:00 — #10
From your response to Wolfgang's assessment.
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T06:44:54-04:00 — #11
Doesn't clear up a thing. I am not connecting any dots of your thought processes (??). Help me....
dave_l — 2017-10-18T06:47:38-04:00 — #12
I only asked if you would try to save the 1000 since you and Wolfgang appear to think they are sub-standard being produced by "science". Would you try to save them?
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T06:54:01-04:00 — #13
I simply can't imagine how you got such an idea. I am quite curious because you so often invent things you insist others believe. This is an interesting test of that.
What do you think, Dave? Do you know that is what I think because I have to think it? What if I responded, "If you are saved, you would know?"
[I am not being difficult. According to your practice, it doesn't matter what I say, you will insist I think what you say I think. ]
dave_l — 2017-10-18T07:01:20-04:00 — #14
Your comments struck me as odd. In the context of Wolfgang's abhorrence of the origins of the 1000 babies, it seemed you both think they are less than human. But you could clear everything up by making a clear statement of your position.
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T07:03:50-04:00 — #15
I am waiting for your answers. Hope that is OK.
Your comments struck me as odd.
That encourages me. It should.
dave_l — 2017-10-18T07:07:01-04:00 — #16
What is the question?
Are hurling insults becoming to a Christian?
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T07:08:09-04:00 — #17
No.... Who is hurling? What insults?
See what I mean about "inventing things you insist others believe?" -- that is why I took this approach--to draw that out.
To answer your question:
I do not see 1000 babies as substandard. I would make every effort to rescue them the same as myself or a 5-year-old child--as I said above, and you would know if you had bothered to read it before answering.
dave_l — 2017-10-18T07:17:47-04:00 — #18
Is it an insult if someone feels insulted by your words?
Thanks for clearing this up.
gao_lu — 2017-10-18T07:18:20-04:00 — #19
Dave, my words apparently felt insulting to you, I am truly, deeply sorry. We play a little rough around her on CD sometimes, but that is no excuse for hurting a Brother.
dave_l — 2017-10-18T07:21:03-04:00 — #20
I took your words as an insult.
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