david_taylor_jr — 2017-11-14T16:02:25-05:00 — #1
I am curious to hear from our Universalist members.
If everyone goes to Heaven, what is the need for evangelism, the Gospel, or even Scripture? What does it matter what people do while here on earth?
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-11-14T16:59:52-05:00 — #2
What people do would seem to matter very little if anything in regards to life in eternity or death and being lost .... perhaps not much different from what those propagate who are followers of the idea that God is the author and cause of everything and all are lost unless God luckily saves some while letting the large rest get lost
gao_lu — 2017-11-14T20:34:05-05:00 — #3
Oops....posted the wrong place.
dave_l — 2017-11-15T04:41:04-05:00 — #4
What people fail to grasp is that Salvation and Reprobation are not about people. It is about God glorifying himself forever displaying his goodness according to his wrath on sinners, and displaying his goodness in his mercy on sinners.
“What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,” (Romans 9:22–23)
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-11-15T07:27:56-05:00 — #5
Seems like you have a god whose purpose is to entertain Himself doing both good and evil in order to supposedly show "his Glory" ... man actually has no value to him, except for being a pawn / puppet used in the self entertaining show this god is involved in-
david_taylor_jr — 2017-11-15T07:42:56-05:00 — #6
This is not about Calvinism, please for once, can we all stay on topic?
dave_l — 2017-11-15T07:45:57-05:00 — #7
How can God's glory not be on topic? Especially when universal salvation obliterates it?
david_taylor_jr — 2017-11-15T07:58:00-05:00 — #8
Because I asked a SPECIFIC question about the Universalist position. That is what this thread is about. Please stay on topic this time.
gao_lu — 2017-11-15T19:07:39-05:00 — #9
I too am watchful, hoping for an answer to David's question.
fred — 2017-11-15T20:44:36-05:00 — #10
I don't concur with the universalist position; but I wouldn't mind being wrong on this point.
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-11-16T08:18:51-05:00 — #11
Here's a pointed answer to your question:
Seems to me that the answer to your questions would be: "there is no need for evangelism, the Gospel, or even Scripture. Furthermore, it does not matter what people do while here on earth.
fred — 2017-11-16T13:44:06-05:00 — #12
There is need to restrain evil, learn about God and His desires for us. The need to worship God, how to treat others, a future hope, ... it's not all about going to heaven. Thus your answer does not make universalism an impossibility.
Aside: I am not a universalist. This doesn't mean I can't appreciate an invalid argument against universalism.
dave_l — 2017-11-16T13:47:08-05:00 — #13
Can you show from scripture why God created the universe and all that it contains?
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-11-16T14:32:13-05:00 — #14
Can you? I am not sure to what you refer or what it is that you are looking for ...
dave_l — 2017-11-16T14:38:25-05:00 — #15
Why did God create according to scripture?
david_taylor_jr — 2017-11-16T14:48:25-05:00 — #16
How is this related to the topic??
dave_l — 2017-11-16T14:58:52-05:00 — #17
I was answering Wolfgang being polite. Sorry.
wolfgang_schneider — 2017-11-16T16:00:15-05:00 — #18
I couldn't figure that out either ... what Dave_L is asking about seems unrelated to the topic. Perhaps he can clarify, so that others can see a connection if there is one?
gao_lu — 2017-11-16T17:33:55-05:00 — #19
Either that or just get on with the topic. I think there is at least one staunch Universalist here who either cannot or will not answer. Maybe more time is needed.
bill_coley — 2017-11-16T17:54:09-05:00 — #20
Though I think it quite nice of you to provide said "staunch universalist" with the option of choosing a lack of will, ability, or time as the reason for his or her absence from this thread, Gao Lu, I wonder whether identifications and speculations such as yours might themselves be something other than "on topic." What do you think?
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